For context Trump’s numbers are (according to the Economist, but most polls are similar):
34% approve
61% disapprove
4% unsure
So the DSA’s approval is less than Trump’s, but there’s a much larger percentage in the “Don’t know” column. Which makes sense, Trump is an incumbent, everyone knows him, while a lot of people don’t know what the DSA is about. But then I’m not sure the DSA knows what the DSA is about.
So Trump’s net approval is -27 while the DSA’s is -17. So the DSA is currently at 10% better than a criminal pedophile.
Obviously that 23% “Don’t know” number is significant. If every single person that doesn’t know about the DSA learns more about them and decides they like them, then I guess the DSA could get to a net approval of +6. But if people learn more about them they fall into similar categories as those that already have an opinion, then their net approval approval would drop to similar levels to Trump.
If they could clean things up a bit in regards to the antisemitism and things like “America deserved 9/11” kind of rhetoric they could improve their numbers. But I don’t think the DSA is interested in doing that. So they’re probably going to be stuck at around a net -20.
There’s good reason why people like Abdul El-Sayed and AOC are distancing themselves from the DSA.
you’re assuming that the 47% unfavorable are there because they know what the DSA are about?
My theory is that they are unfavorable because of hundred years of propaganada against anything opposing capitalism, partially caused by the media being owned by the wealthy, as well as hundreds of millions or more from Israel to discredit the ones that oppose their genocides.
Leftists are just really terrible at communicating with the working class. It’s mostly a movement coming out of universities where the goal is to prove how clever you are to everyone else. That just doesn’t play well with the working class.
You’re implying that the working class doesn’t like leftism because they’re too stupid. Consider the possibility that how you think about the working class might have something to do with why the working class doesn’t like you.
And you have too many leftists that are completely disconnected from reality. This comes at the expense of the working class.
Anyone who has worked with someone that’s from Eastern Europe or has read a history book documenting the famines in the Soviet Union or China are really going to be turned off by a conversation with a tankie. When leftists dismiss the plight of the working class in these countries as being minor details because there’s a “bigger picture” that’s more important? Yeah that’s not going to fly with the working class. Obviously.
Really if leftists cared about reaching the working class they’d drop the use of the word “socialist” entirely. People obviously associate that word with the USSR, because that word is actually in the name of the country. But leftist care more about winning some debate (it’s the university crowd) so feel like if they can successfully argue that socialism is good actually, they have achieved something. The working class should appreciate us for how clever we are!
But how clever is it to think that a socialist movement can have success without the working class? There’s a lack of any kind of wisdom coming from leftism.
And this is why the left has an antisemitism problem. It’s forbidden to ever discuss the issue. I’ve seen people on the left say that Jews have been evil throughout history, I’ve seen leftists openly admit they want to kill all Jews. People post rationalizations for why all Jews are an acceptable target of harassment even if they’ve never set foot in Israel.
But there’s a blanket rationalization for why that kind of talk is completely fine because it’s “criticizing Israel”. That rationalization only works within your group. You’ve created a permission structure for antisemitism, and automatically block anyone who brings up the problem.
These rationalizations and whitewashing only work within your group. Everyone else just sees some bullies harassing Jews at synagogues. You can see in the polling data that your movement is unpopular. You can’t even consider there may be reasons why. You can’t even discuss those reasons because your group forbids that kind of discussion. The first step is to admit there’s a problem, but leftists are incapable of doing that.
Some of them are, some of them aren’t. They’re basically Schrodinger’s communists. Both communist and not communist until you have a conversation with someone from the DSA.
Maybe you talk to someone in the DSA that says “hey we just want things like better healthcare” or maybe you talk to someone that wants to burn everything down and recreate the Soviet Union to prove it would’ve worked if it started out industrialized or whatever.
For context Trump’s numbers are (according to the Economist, but most polls are similar):
34% approve 61% disapprove 4% unsure
So the DSA’s approval is less than Trump’s, but there’s a much larger percentage in the “Don’t know” column. Which makes sense, Trump is an incumbent, everyone knows him, while a lot of people don’t know what the DSA is about. But then I’m not sure the DSA knows what the DSA is about.
So Trump’s net approval is -27 while the DSA’s is -17. So the DSA is currently at 10% better than a criminal pedophile.
Obviously that 23% “Don’t know” number is significant. If every single person that doesn’t know about the DSA learns more about them and decides they like them, then I guess the DSA could get to a net approval of +6. But if people learn more about them they fall into similar categories as those that already have an opinion, then their net approval approval would drop to similar levels to Trump.
If they could clean things up a bit in regards to the antisemitism and things like “America deserved 9/11” kind of rhetoric they could improve their numbers. But I don’t think the DSA is interested in doing that. So they’re probably going to be stuck at around a net -20.
There’s good reason why people like Abdul El-Sayed and AOC are distancing themselves from the DSA.
you’re assuming that the 47% unfavorable are there because they know what the DSA are about? My theory is that they are unfavorable because of hundred years of propaganada against anything opposing capitalism, partially caused by the media being owned by the wealthy, as well as hundreds of millions or more from Israel to discredit the ones that oppose their genocides.
Yeah, there should be a similar poll simply asking about policies puahed by the DSA.
Leftists are just really terrible at communicating with the working class. It’s mostly a movement coming out of universities where the goal is to prove how clever you are to everyone else. That just doesn’t play well with the working class.
You’re implying that the working class doesn’t like leftism because they’re too stupid. Consider the possibility that how you think about the working class might have something to do with why the working class doesn’t like you.
And you have too many leftists that are completely disconnected from reality. This comes at the expense of the working class.
Anyone who has worked with someone that’s from Eastern Europe or has read a history book documenting the famines in the Soviet Union or China are really going to be turned off by a conversation with a tankie. When leftists dismiss the plight of the working class in these countries as being minor details because there’s a “bigger picture” that’s more important? Yeah that’s not going to fly with the working class. Obviously.
Really if leftists cared about reaching the working class they’d drop the use of the word “socialist” entirely. People obviously associate that word with the USSR, because that word is actually in the name of the country. But leftist care more about winning some debate (it’s the university crowd) so feel like if they can successfully argue that socialism is good actually, they have achieved something. The working class should appreciate us for how clever we are!
But how clever is it to think that a socialist movement can have success without the working class? There’s a lack of any kind of wisdom coming from leftism.
Reminder, disliking Israel murdering all the Palestinians is not anti-semetic, that’s propaganda working.
And this is why the left has an antisemitism problem. It’s forbidden to ever discuss the issue. I’ve seen people on the left say that Jews have been evil throughout history, I’ve seen leftists openly admit they want to kill all Jews. People post rationalizations for why all Jews are an acceptable target of harassment even if they’ve never set foot in Israel.
But there’s a blanket rationalization for why that kind of talk is completely fine because it’s “criticizing Israel”. That rationalization only works within your group. You’ve created a permission structure for antisemitism, and automatically block anyone who brings up the problem.
These rationalizations and whitewashing only work within your group. Everyone else just sees some bullies harassing Jews at synagogues. You can see in the polling data that your movement is unpopular. You can’t even consider there may be reasons why. You can’t even discuss those reasons because your group forbids that kind of discussion. The first step is to admit there’s a problem, but leftists are incapable of doing that.
Is the netanyahu government committing genocide? Yes or lie.
My opinion on this matter is generally banned from being discussed within leftist communities.
You need to go outside of this little bubble to have discussions on that topic. If you’re not afraid of ideas, of course.
So “lie”. Got it.
You support genocide and are pretending that anyone who doesn’t is antisemitic.
It is no lie that leftist channels ban conversations on this subject.
So now it’s your turn, do you think Hamas committed genocidal acts on October 7? Yes or lie.
October 7 was a terrorist attack. October 7 does not justify genocide. But of course centrists like you see genocide as good by itself.
Absolutely. And there’s no way all of that 47% knows that the DSA is an actual communist group.
Some of them are, some of them aren’t. They’re basically Schrodinger’s communists. Both communist and not communist until you have a conversation with someone from the DSA.
Maybe you talk to someone in the DSA that says “hey we just want things like better healthcare” or maybe you talk to someone that wants to burn everything down and recreate the Soviet Union to prove it would’ve worked if it started out industrialized or whatever.
Yes, they should be more consistent. Like centrists, who reliably support genocide and nothing else.